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[personal profile] eide
[livejournal.com profile] judiff wrote a little in her DeadJournal about ageplay. We all find it incredibly squicky. And she was upset about ageplayers using words like "littles" which we think of as plurality words.
I'm really not wanting to know about ageplay either but i'm worried this could turn into one of those warms like between multiples and soul-bonders. Or the one between Trans people and Cross Dresers (which i only see from the outside but which impacts on people i care about). So maybe there needs to be some communication between the two communitys?

So i'm noddling some possible questions

Are there people who do both? Are the differences as clear as they seem to be in my head
Do we mean the same things by words like "littles" and "bigs"?
How can we not offend or insult each other?
How can we clear up any confusion from people within either community or outside it about which we are?

What else do we need to be asking each other?

I'm not really expecting anyone tcome up with any answers - at least not yet but where can we start with this?

Date: August 28th, 2009 02:42 pm (UTC)
ext_40378: (Default)
From: [identity profile] skibbley.livejournal.com
I'm interested in finding out a bit more about plurality and about age-play and how they might interact.

Since age-play is something I'm both fairly ignorant of and uncomfortable with I wonder if a caring and supportive group of non-ageplay people could get together with a written description of ageplay (much like the Community Info Zone stuff at BiCons) and talk about it.

Date: August 28th, 2009 02:52 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] tartful-dodger.livejournal.com
It sounds like a nice idea, but its one of those things where people who become educated do so through personal experience, and the loudest none ageplay voices are usually the disapproving ones.

Also there's an element of people speaking for other people that means it might not be the most enlightened environment, and is often a way of people getting together to treat a marginalised group as a problem and bitch about it, with noone there to speak for them. Knowing how that works for other marginalised group that can produce uncomfortability in others...those rarely go well.

Personally I'd suggest either finding online resources, or finding someone who is sufficiently comfortable with their ageplay interests that they can talk from personal experience, and listen to other people without becoming too defensive, who is happy to answer questions.

Date: August 28th, 2009 03:21 pm (UTC)
ext_40378: (Default)
From: [identity profile] skibbley.livejournal.com
eide: please say if it isn't ok to have this discussion here

tartful_dodger: I think I get your point about groups discussing something without a representative of that group present, and less useful places that could read. If I thought a group of people who were uncomfortable with part of my sexuality were getting together to discuss it I would have similar concerns.

I also think that creating a space to share discomfort safely and constructively might be useful and possible without certain groups present. I think a group of non-ageplayers could discuss our feelings with an understanding of working on limited information and leave some questions to be asked later. For me, this would be similar to a group of straight people wanting to talk about their discomfort with queer people - it could be done in a context of them wanting to be supportive and non-homophobic.

Alternatively, an age-player who would be not too defensive might be a good person to include, thanks for the suggestion.

I don't identify as multiple. I support consenting adults doing ageplay as I would any consensual activity - whether or not I liked it. I am uncomfortable with it on a personal level and am not sure quite why yet or how to express that.

Date: August 28th, 2009 03:31 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] tartful-dodger.livejournal.com
I'm only recently coming to that sort of level of comfortability myself, but I'm able to empathise with the sentiment of 'I'm good with all consenting kinks on an intellectual level, but *that* makes my brain go splat', as I have similar reactions about male dom/female sub stuff, sometimes.

Kinks something that generally plays with things that are only acceptable in very specific contexts, and I think that's why its so common for some things to induce levels of uncomfortability.

Date: August 28th, 2009 03:10 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] tartful-dodger.livejournal.com

I'm not sure neccesarily the differences are as big as all that in all cases.

One thing that I should probably explain is that a lot of people don't actually feel all that comfortable with the actual label of Ageplay, as the play element is seen as far more superficial than their experiences actually are.

I don't know enough plurality to know precisely what to say as a comparison; for a start I'd never heard the terms Big and Little used outside of ageplay before this post!

For people who are familiar with D/s I can begin to explain a little though...

There's almost a sliding scale

Completely Artificial: Playing with roles in a very conscious and separate from reality sort of way.

Artifical contexts that inspire genuine emotions or headspaces: People for whom being in a certain scene allows them to access genuine emotions, but only for the duration of a scene, and may help them to access parts of themselves which usually remain hidden or inaccessible

Naturally occuring dynamics with are a responsive to specific people: I feel __ around __ person

Personality elements that exist outside of a D/s context, being recognised and given validity in a specific context: everybody fits somewhere on scales of assertive/passive, mature/playful*, dominant/submissive, but not everybody chooses to apply that in any sort of kink based context.

Ageplayers tend to fit somewhere along those lines in ways near unique to each person, and for a lot of people its an expression of personality or aspect of a personality rather than a simple 'I like to roleplay' element.

I can't comment on what the overlap with plurals is on the grounds that I don't know terribly much about plurals, and the hows and whys.

* I'm avoiding the phrase immature due to its negative cannotations here.

Hopefully this can at least open up the dialogue a little :)
Edited Date: August 28th, 2009 03:11 pm (UTC)

Date: August 28th, 2009 03:17 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] tartful-dodger.livejournal.com
Also, I'm not exactly sure of our history of big and little, and how long we've had them but I believe it came about so as to be catch all, and easily distinguishable from real children.

I'm not sure how else we would go about putting it, how other people are using it, and if anybody is anymore entitled to use it than anybody else.

It would be nice to hear how plurals use the terms, as its nothing I've heard of before

I personally use the terms as ways of captioning elements of my personality, and differentiating headspaces.

Date: August 28th, 2009 04:54 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] baratron.livejournal.com
I have been wondering whether some ageplayers do so as a way of expressing multiplicity. Your people are quite separate and very definitely That Age, but some bodies have more connection/fluidity between their people.


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